S. Berliner, III's sbiii.com Long Island Motor Parkway Page 9 keywords = Long Island Motor Parkway Vanderbilt toll road limited access highway Horace Harding boulevard automotive auto car truck car history Dudgeon Miller Seyfried

Updated:   19 May 2010, 22:35  ET
[Page created 20 Mar 2001; converted 19 May 2010;

    original AT&T Worldnet Website begun 30 May 1996.]
Update info on the top on ALL pages for your convenience.

URL:  http://sbiii.com/limpkwy9.html
[was at "home.att.net/~Berliner-Ultrasonics/limpkwy9.html"]

S. Berliner, III
Consultant in Ultrasonic Processing
"changing materials with high-intensity sound"

[consultation is on a fee basis]

Technical and Historical Writer, Oral Historian
Popularizer of Science and Technology
Rail, Auto, Air, Ordnance, and Model Enthusiast
Light-weight Linguist, Lay Minister, and Putative Philosopher



note - The vast bulk of my massive Web presence (over 485 pages) has been hosted by AT&T's WorldNet service since 30 May 1996; they are dropping WorldNet effective 31 Mar 2010 and I have to scramble to transfer everything by then.  Everything's saved but all the links have to be changed, mostly by hand.  See my sbiii.com Transfer Page for any updates on this tedious process.


S. Berliner, III's

sbiii.com

Long Island Motor Parkway Page 9

Because the Main Page overloaded, please visit the many Continuation Pages noted on the LIMP Index page.


PAGE INDEX

note-rt.gif  The index on this page has been truncated to save page space; see the LIMP Index on the page preceding the main LIMP page.

On the main LIMP page:

    HISTORY OF THE LONG ISLAND MOTOR PARKWAY,
        now continued on the LONG ISLAND MOTOR PARKWAY HISTORY page, and
        on the LONG ISLAND MOTOR PARKWAY HISTORY page 2.

On Continuation Page 0:

    LIMP POSTS (and reinforced concrete).
    LONG ISLAND MOTOR PARKWAY TIMELINE.
    LINKS to the LONG ISLAND MOTOR PARKWAY.
    LONG ISLAND MOTOR PARKWAY BIBLIOGRAPHY.

On Continuation Page 1A:

    LONG ISLAND MOTOR PARKWAY TODAY.
    LONG ISLAND MOTOR PARKWAY BRIDGES.
    LONG ISLAND MOTOR PARKWAY at confluence of Marcus/Lakeville/NSParkway,
        (continued on this page).

On Continuation Page 2:

    More on the Long Island Motor Parkway.
    Views of the Long Island Motor Parkway Today.
    I. U. Willets Road Fragment.
    Roslyn Road Fragment.
    Bridge at Old Bethpage Village Restoration.
    Horace Harding (of Boulevard fame).
    Open LIMP Matters - Questions and Speculations.

On Continuation Page 3:

    Crossings from Roslyn Road to the Maxess Road Bridge.

On Continuation Page 4:

    Old Courthouse Road Bridge, New Hyde Park.
    Garden City Toll Lodge.
    Crossings Continued - Maxess/Duryea Road Bridge.
    More on Duryea Road Crossing.

On Continuation Page 5:

    LI MOTOR PARKWAY SPURS.
    PERSONAL LI MOTOR PARKWAY APOCRYPHA,
       and now continued on the LIMP Apocrypha Page.
    LEVITTOWN GRANDSTAND AREA
    DEAD MAN'S CURVE REDIVIVUS.

On Continuation Page 6:

    LI MOTOR PARKWAY at WlLLISTON/ALBERTSON/SEARINGTOWN
        (moved from Page 5 - 28 Mar 00).
    Dubious Artifact at NSP/NHP Road.
    Queens Vignettes.

On Continuation Page 7:

    OLD BETHPAGE AREA Update.
    ROUTE 110 SAND PITS AREA Update.

On Continuation Page 8:

    North Hills.
    Mineola-Carle Place.

On this Continuation Page 9:

    LONG ISLAND MOTOR PARKWAY at confluence         of Marcus/Lakeville/NSParkway, continued,
        with Great Neck Toll Lodge.
    Road and Place Names - Old and New (and Bogus).

On Continuation Page 10:

    Additional WILLISTON-NEW HYDE PARK ROAD Documentation.
    Bronx River Parkway.

On Continuation Page 11:

    1941 Queens Aerial Photos.

On the Queens Page:

    Western Terminus
        (193th St./Peck Av./Underhill Blvd./Horace Harding Blvd./LIE).

On Queens Continuation Page 1:

    Fresh Meadows Ballfields and Theater

On the Suffolk Page:

    Eastern Terminus (Lake Ronkonkoma).


This is yet another (20 Mar 01) page to cover additional information and photographs of this interesting old highway; see also my Automotive, Chrysler, Dudgeon (really!), Mercedes, and SS and JAGUAR car pages and other related pages.


A Motor Parkway Panel has been convened to keep the LIMP alive in minds and museums.

There is also a lot of automotive material on my ORDNANCE and HISTORY pages.

Also, if you like automotive history, see the links on the Automotive page.


RoW = Right-of-Way.


LONG ISLAND MOTOR PARKWAY - continued

[There are many missing images on this page - please bear with me.]


LAKEVILLE ROAD DOCUMENTATION,
continuing coverage at the Marcus Boulevard//Lakeville Road/Northern State Parkway confluence,
and specifically at the Great Neck Toll Lodge
and the Great Neck South schools property.

Missing Image Notice

Having gone as far east (E) on the Great Neck South schools property as the gate at the eastern end of the still-paved segment of the Motor Parkway, I felt that I should not wander off into the woods on school property without sanction.  Having been granted permission, on 19 Mar 01 I returned and, with an escort, continued the photodocumentation just inside the gate, looking E towards the RH curve ESE and the site of the Northern State Parkway bridge at New Hyde Park Road.  There does not appear to be any pavement under foot but the curbing continues about 100 yards in from the gate and then stops abruptly, just short (W) of the curve:

MP at GNS 01/2
(All photos taken 19 Mar 01 by and © 2001 S. Berliner, III - all rights reserved)
[Thumbnail images; click on pictures for large images.]

Continuing easterly 100' or so, we come to the curve, itself.  Construction and later widening of NSP really tore hell out of the remanent LIMP RoW here!  The actual alignment is purely conjectural from here on, but it correlates well with the aerial view on page 1.  The first shot below is taken standing at the E end of the N curb and the second up on the RoW in the curve (you can just barely make out the S/B NHP Road exit sign on the E/B NSP to the far left and a whitish object to the right):

MP at GNS 03/4

In the next shot, I stuck the lens up against the GNS/NSP boundary fence, standing roughly on the assumed RoW centerline (again, there is that exit sign on the left and the whitish object on the right) and, turning 180°, we are looking from the RoW centerline at the boundary fence back along the curve:

MP at GNS 05/6

Heading back to the escort vehicle, visible in the distance from the middle of the curve, we then see the end of the paving, with North Shore Towers barely visible to the left (the schools are off to the right):

MP at GNS 07/8

and, finally, we come back to the vehicle and take a shot looking W through the E gate:

MP at GNS 09
(All photos taken 19 Mar 01 by and © 2001 S. Berliner, III - all rights reserved)
[Thumbnail images; click on pictures for large images.]

Great Neck Toll Lodge

Heading back to the parking lots, I took a walkaround tour of the back of the big house at 357 Lakeville Road (from outside their property, on the GNS schools grounds).  It becomes quite evident (this is no longer conjecture) that the house did NOT engulf the Great Neck Toll Lodge at all; THERE IT IS! (these views are from the N and then walking around to the E, and S - thus looking S, W, and N, respectively):

MP at GNS 10/11

Just look at the roof lines of the rear projection and especially at that little two-story extension sticking out at the rear!

MP at GNS 12/13/14/15

You can even see the toll portico roofline between the first and second stories of the small extension:

MP at GNS 16/17/18
(All photos taken 19 Mar 01 by and © 2001 S. Berliner, III - all rights reserved)
[Thumbnail images; click on pictures for large images.]

One last view of the Great Neck Toll Lodge and I started to drive out when I realized that to the SW was a view overlooking the big-house-cum-lodge, the RoW, and the crossing of Lakeville Road, so I stopped, parked yet again, unlimbered the digital one more time, and took these pictures - starting with a fake panorama (made by combining the four shots which follow, taken from slightly different angles) showing the big house on the left with its driveway in the foreground, the LIMP RoW beyond, and the fence and gate at Lakeville Road with the RoW curving S through the Jewish Center and with the NSP in the distance at right:

MP at GNS pan/019/20/21/22
[Thumbnail images; click on pictures for large images.]


Photos (looking SE - distant and close up) taken at the Old Bethpage Village Restoration bridge site recently (late Mar/early Apr 01) show severe deterioration of the north cheek and even worse dumping and overgrowth!

OBVR Bridge Apr 01
(Photos by T. Sisler - courtesy of R. Sisler - all rights reserved)
[Thumbnail images; click on pictures for larger images.]

We MUST save this irreplaceable technical artifact!  Happily, the new Nassau Parks administration agrees and has fenced off the site and will start clearing the dumps and have the County Engineer inspect the bridge.  Progress, at long last!  Next, we must save the Old Courthouse Road bridge and threatened extant parcels of the RoW in both Nassau and Suffolk counties.  Also heartening, various groups with related interests have signed on as supportive of our efforts (antique auto enthusiasts, bicyclists, hikers, etc.).


Road and Place Names - Old and New (and Bogus)

The Long Island Motor Parkway has been known by many misleading and just-plain-wrong names (especially as the Vanderbilt Motor Parkway, as indicated at the beginning of the main LIMP and Panel pages), but there are many other road names (and place names) that have been changed over the years that may trap the unwary LIMP researcher.  One of the most noticeable examples, one that comes up frequently, is Central Park (now Bethpage).  Accordingly, I am posting here a cross-referenced alphabetical index here to Road and Place Names related to the Long Island Motor Parkway:

    [BOLD FACE distinguishes old names]

    {This is too much like work and strains the brain!}

Bedloe's Island - now Liberty Island {oops, wrong list!}.
Bell Boulevard - was (in part) Rocky Hill Road.
Bethpage - was Central Park.
Bethpage-Sweet Hollow Road is also known as Sweet Hollow Road and (incorrectly) as Spagnoli or Bethpage-Spagnoli Road (that's the older Suffolk County name).
Black Stump Road - now 73rd Avenue.
Blackwell's Island - later Welfare island, now Roosevelt Island {wrong list!}.
Booth Memorial Avenue - was North Hempstead Turnpike (NOT Rt. 25A) {also "Road"}.
Braddock Avenue - was part of Rocky Hill Road.
Central Park - now Bethpage.
Commack Spur, a.k.a. Smithtown Spur - now Harned Road.
Claremont Road - NW end disconnected, now Schoolhouse Lane; central section now
    S access to Old Bethpage Village Restoration at Bethpage-Sweet Hollow Road.  Claremont was also Smiths Road once and overlaps Winding Road at Bethpage-Sweet Hollow Road.
Creedmoor Parkway - never realized - was to run from NHT and LIMP SE down to Union Turnpike at 217th Street.
Cross Island Boulevard (NOT the Parkway) - now Francis Lewis Boulevard.
Cunningham Park - was Hillside Park.
Francis Lewis Boulevard - was Cross Island Boulevard (NOT the Parkway).
Harned Road - was Commack Spur, a.k.a. Smithtown Spur.
Hillside Park - now Cunningham Park.
Hilton (or Jerusalem) Road - now the N-S Stewart Avenue in Plainedge.
Hoffman Boulevard - {probably now Queens Boulevard - see Note 1}.
Hollis Court Boulevard - the southern end, which was still that in my 1966 NYC Hagstrom's,
    is now shown as Hollis Hills Terrace in my 1998 NYC Hagstrom's.
    [I could swear it was still HCB down by the LIMP RoW when I was last there on 28 Apr 00.]
    The northern stretch (or all of it per 1925 map) was Queens Avenue
    [also known as Queens Road, as confirmed parenthetically on a ca. 1938 NYC Dept. of Parks
      property map of the 73rd Avenue (Black Stump Road) area].
Hollis Hills Terrace - the southern end of Hollis Court Boulevard, q.v.
Horace Harding Boulevard - still there but now the N and S service roads of the LIE in places.
    (except just east of the Queens-Nassau border - where it's still there all on its own).
    [Horace Harding Expressway is the service road for other parts of the LIE,
    at least just east of the Van Wyck interchange     as well as just west of the Queens/Nassau line.]
    Was Nassau Boulevard {see Note 2}.
Idlewild Golf Course-cum-Airport - now JFK (oops, again; I'm fixated!}.
Jerusalem (or Hilton) Road - now the N-S Stewart Avenue in Plainedge.   new.gif (25 Nov 05)
Luke Place - was part of Rocky Hill Road.
Long Island Expressway (the big LIE / the world's longest parking lot) - did not exist then -
    see Horace Harding Boulevard.
Mitchel Field Spur - land acquired, but never built.
Motor Parkway - current Suffolk County Route 67, in part -
    was Long Island Motor Parkway.
Nassau Boulevard (NOT the one in NW Nassau) - later Horace Harding Boulevard {see Note 2}.
North Beach Airport - now LaGuardia {oh, give it up!}.
North Hempstead Turnpike (NOT Rt. 25A) {also "Road"} - now Booth Memorial Avenue
    (even though the hospital no longer bears the name!).
Old Courthouse Road (western end, where it runs N-S) - was northern part of Plattsdale Road.
Plattsdale Road - northern part now western end of Old Courthouse Road (where it runs N-S).
Queens Avenue (not Boulevard) - was the western extension of Hollis Court Boulevard
    beyond Rocky Hill Road (also known as Queens Road)
    [or all of it per 1925 map - confirmed parenthetically in 73rd Avenue (Black Stump Road) area
      on NYC Dept. of Parks property map ca. 1938].
Queens Boulevard (not Avenue) - probably was Hoffman Boulevard - {see Note 1}.
Rocky Hill Road - now Springfield Boulevard {etc. - see Note 3}.
73rd Avenue - was Black Stump Road {74th Avenue is the RoW in eastern Queens}.
Schoolhouse Lane - was NW end of Claremont Road, now disconnected.
Smiths Road was once the name of Claremont Road and overlaps Winding Road at Bethpage-Sweet Hollow Road.
Spagnoli or Bethpage-Spagnoli Road is the older Suffolk County road that was later extended into Nassau County as Sweet Hollow Road or Bethpage-Sweet Hollow Road.
Springfield Boulevard - was Rocky Hill Road.
Stewart Avenue - there are at least three Stewart Avenues involved with the LIMP;

1 - the first runs W-E at the east end of Garden City, where the RoW runs immediately N of it from Clinton Road to Merrick Avenue,
2 - the second runs N-S in East Meadow and the LIMP ran under that one,
3 - and the third runs N-S in Plainedge, where it was initially called Jerusalem Road and Hilton Road and the RoW ran over it (the embankment for that bridge still exists on the east side).

Sweet Hollow Road, also Bethpage-Sweet Hollow Road.
Vanderbilt Motor Parkway - current Suffolk County Route 67, in part -
    was Long Island Motor Parkway.
Vanderbilt Parkway - Suffolk County Route 67, in part -
    was Long Island Motor Parkway.
Winding Road overlaps Claremont Road at Bethpage-Sweet Hollow Road.
Zanzibar - now Tanzania {now CUT that out!}.

    (partial initial listing - to be continued)

Note 1.  Thanks to LIMPer John Gallagher, I have a copy of the 1909 AAA Tour Book, pp. 146-147, where Route 85 has two alternates from the AAA Club House in midtown Manhattan to the Grandstand; the second, Route 85B, is labelled "Via 34th St. Ferry - 28.5 m." but directs one to cross the Queensborough Bridge and then, from Thompson Street, take Hoffman Avenue 6.1 m. to the trolley tracks in Newtown and then 6.9 m. to Hillside Avenue in Jamaica; thus Hoffman almost HAS to be today's Queens Boulevard.

Note 2.  Nassau Boulevard appears on the 1927 Socony VC race brochure as the western entrance to the LIMP from New York and Brooklyn on three alternate routes:  via Flushing - Queensborough Bridge to L onto Jackson Avenue to R onto Jamaica-Flushing Avenue to L onto North Hempstead Road to Nassau Boulevard; via Long Island City - QBB to R onto Queens Boulevard to L onto Union Turnpike to L onto Fresh Meadows Road to R onto Nassau Boulevard; and via Jamaica - Hillside Avenue to Fresh Meadows Road to R onto Nassau Boulevard.  Horace Harding Boulevard is shown as formerly Nassau Boulevard in Fresh Meadows on the 1937 Queens Hagstrom's.  This is NOT the Nassau Boulevard running N-S in Franklin Square and Garden City.
    (this link refers to a page with an explanation of just where Nassau Boulevard is today (with a map).

Note 3.  Four blocks of Rocky Hill Road still exist between 47th Avenue at Francis Lewis Boulevard and the Clearview Expressway at 48th Avenue.  In addition, Panel member Kevin Walsh advises that parts of Bell Boulevard, all of Luke Place, and Braddock Avenue were called Rocky Hill Road before all the cross streets were cut through (must have been laid out by a native American on firewater!  Almost as cockeyed as some old parkway this guy Vanderbilt built!).

I probably should add the varying Toll Lodge/Exit names as well.  Ah, impermanence!  See Toll Lodges and Toll Gates on the main LIMP History page.


Speaking of "bogus", I got a report in early Jun 01 that there was a row of LIMP posts along the W boundary of Clark Garden at the LIRR Albertson Station so, returning from my Alley Pond Park trip on 06 Jun 01, I stopped by and this is what I found:

Post at Clark/Albertson
(Photo taken 06 Jun 01 by and © 2001 S. Berliner, III - all rights reserved)
[Thumbnail image; click on picture for large image.]

Not only is it NOT a LIMP post, it doesn't even look like one up close, nor do the other half dozen or so; they are yellowish, have chamfered corners and top, are not square in cross-section, and have different hole spacing.  I appreciate the tip, wrong though it turned out to be.


Because the Main Page overloaded, please visit the many Continuation Pages noted on the LIMP Index page.


LEGACY

  What happens to all this when I DIE or (heaven forfend!) lose interest?  See LEGACY.

COPYRIGHT NOTICE

See Copyright Notice on primary home page.



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