S. Berliner, III's Long Island Rail Road Page 7 keywords = rail road way Long Island LIRR DE30AC DM30AC steam diesel boxcab locomotive restoration Pennsylvania Pennsy PRR Kiesel Berlinerwerke Vest Pocket Degnon Brooklyn Eastern District Terminal BEDT New York Atlantic Cross Harbor Dock Black River Western

Updated:   19 Sep 2012  11:50  ET
[Page converted 12 Sep 2012; created 23 Sep 2002>

    original AT&T Worldnet Website begun 30 May 1996.]
URL:  http://sbiii.com/lirr7etc.html
[was at "home.att.net/~Berliner-Ultrasonics/lirr7etc.html"]

S. Berliner, III
Consultant in Ultrasonic Processing
"changing materials with high-intensity sound"

[consultation is on a fee basis]

Technical and Historical Writer, Oral Historian
Popularizer of Science and Technology
Rail, Auto, Air, Ordnance, and Model Enthusiast
Light-weight Linguist, Lay Minister, and Putative Philosopher

note - The vast bulk of my massive Web presence (over 485 pages) had been hosted by AT&T's WorldNet service since 30 May 1996; they dropped WorldNet effective 31 Mar 2010 and I have been scrambling to transfer everything.  Everything's saved but all the links have to be changed, mostly by hand.  See my sbiii.com Transfer Page for any updates on this tedious process.

S. Berliner, III's


Long Island Rail Road Page 7




(and related Long Island railroad information)

LIRR Keystone

[this page was separated out from my RAILROAD, LI Rail Road, and LI Railroads pages;
you might wish to see them also.]

NOTE:  Page size was limited by HTML to some 30kB; thus, I was forced to add this continuation page to fit the LIRR and related information, as well as several other continuation pages.
You may wish to visit my RR page, as well.

Also, LILS - the Long Island Live Steamers courtesy page had to be moved to a separate page.

There are two related topics here on these pages:
(1) The Long Island Rail Road and (2) Long Island railroad information.

There IS a difference!

The Long Island Rail Road is the official name of the oldest Class 1 railroad still operating under its original name and charter (the B&O was older but has been subsumed into CSX).  Although there remain some offical documents with the two words combined, the correct name of the LIRR has the two words separately:
"Long Island Rail Road"!

There were and are other railroads on Long Island - these also are (or will be) covered on the LI Railroads page.


If these links don't work, click "back" and scroll down!

NOTE:  To conserve space, I have severely truncated the index on this page; see the LIRR index page.

    including LIRR boxcabs #401, the world's first production diesel road switcher,
    #402 (first and second), #403, and many others.

Brooklyn Eastern District Terminal Railroad,
    and its successor roads, the New York Cross Harbor Railroad and New York Regional Rail.

Degnon Terminal Railroad, etc.


On the (first) LIRR page:
    Long Island Sunrise-Trail Chapter (National Railway Historical Society)
    Sunrise Trail Division (Northeastern Region, National Model Railroad Association)
    Steam Locomotive #35 Restoration Committee

(Friends of Locomotive #35 Incorporated)
Restoration of Pennsy Class G5 Long Island Rail Road 4-6-0 #35
    Steam Locomotive #39 Restoration
(Railroad Museum of Long island)
Restoration of Pennsy Class G5 Long Island Rail Road 4-6-0 #39

On LIRR Continuation Page 1a:

On the LIRR Continuation Page 2:

    Odd Incident at Wreck Lead (on the LIRR)
    LIRR and LI Railroad Miscellany
    Converted LIRR HEP/Cab Control Units
    Central RR of LI - moved to this page 5 on 17 Dec 00

and now to a separate CRR of LI page on 17 Feb 2002.
    Dashing Dan and Dottie.

On the LIRR Continuation Page 3:
    Nassau County Police 2nd Pct. Booth D/Locust Tower
    Victorian Stations Still Standing on the LIRR

On the LIRR Continuation Page 4:
    Blissville and Laurel Hill Sidings, Maspeth Yard, and Fresh Pond Yard

and NY&AR/NYCRR Interchange info.
    LIRR MISCELLANY - continued

On the LIRR Continuation Page 5:
    Central RR of LI - moved to separate CRR page on 17 Feb 02.
    LIRR DE30AC and DM30AC Locomotives
    Victorian LIRR Stations (continued)

Locust Valley Station
Glen Street Station (update)
Oyster Bay Station (moved to LIRR page 7 on 23 Sep 02)

On the LIRR Continuation Page 6:
    Nassau County Police 2nd Pct. Booth D/Locust Tower (cont'd)

On this LIRR Continuation Page 7:
    Victorian LIRR Stations (continued from LIRR pages 2 and 5)

Oyster Bay Station (moved from LIRR page 5 on 23 Sep 02)
Oyster Bay Station Photos
Oyster Bay Station Dimensions

On the LIRR Continuation Page 8:
    Victorian LIRR Stations (continued from LIRR pages 2, 5, and 7)

More on Oyster Bay Station (continued from LIRR page 7 on 23 Sep 02)
More Oyster Bay Station Photos
More Oyster Bay Station Dimensions

On the Central RR of LI Page:
    Central RR of LI - moved 17 Dec 00,

and again on 17 Feb 02 to a separate CRR of LI page.

Salisbury Plains Station ca. 1974
(Salisbury Plains Station on the LIRR Central Branch ca. 1974.)
[Photograph courtesy of A. Huneke - all rights reserved.]

    Bethpage Branch.

On the LI Railroads Continuation Page:
    Long Island Railroads [with a link to the NYCRR (Hell Gate)]

On separate pages:

The New York & Atlantic Railway, lessor of LIRR freight operations.

Railroad Eagles - Penn Station, Grand Central Terminal, etc.

Long Island Rail Road Historical Society.

Victorian LIRR Stations
(continued from
LIRR Continuation Page 3 and LIRR Continuation Page 5)

[Any reference to "Friends of Locomotive #35, Inc." is NOT an official statement by that group.]

Oyster Bay Station

    (moved from LIRR page 5 on 23 Sep 2002)

{The Oyster Bay station is actually "Edwardian"!}

Since Friends of Locomotive #35 which will set up and staff the rairoad museum planned for the old Oyster Bay train station, has no plans (drawings, that is, not ideas) for the 1902 structure, I think I'll document it* the way I did Sea Cliff and East Williston.  Until I do, suffice it that the building is 100 years old, it was Teddy Roosevelt's home station, and we (#35 and the Oyster Bay Historical Society had a grand celebration on Saturday, 07 Sep 2002, replete with the "Colonel", himself!

TR liked to ride trains (not that he had much choice) and would talk with the crew and give them silver dollars:

(photos courtesy OBHS via D. Morrison - all rights reserved)

This is supposedly the original 1889 frame station at Oyster Bay (I'm not convinced - it's too grand and the layout somehow just doesn't look right to me, especially the shed and the chimneys):

orig{?} 1889 OB Station
(photo courtesy OBHS via D. Morrison - all rights reserved)

There's a great shot of TR, as V.P. in 1901, sitting on a bench, looking up from his paper, at the southwest corner of that building, waiting for a train, on page 245 of NEWSDAY's "LONG ISLAND - OUR STORY" (1998).

Here's how the Colonel arrived, and was picked up, at the station in Oyster Bay; driven in great style and with great dignity by Joe Washington, his driver (shown):

TR's Driver at OB Station 1 TR's Driver at OB Station 2
(photo courtesy OBHS via D. Morrison - all rights reserved)

Now, we see el Presidente about to leave the station and on his way:

TR at OB Station TR leaving OB Station
(photos courtesy OBHS via D. Morrison - all rights reserved)

Here are a bunch of photos by Dave Morrison (who was the Oyster Bay Branch Manager until his recent retirement) of the 100th Anniversary celebration.  We start with Teddy (portrayed by Jim Foote of neighboring Sea Cliff) timing the almost-punctual arrival of the early afternoon train, greeting the crew (no silver dollars, but he DID give out seegars).

The train is No. 6506, the 12:14 pm from Penn Station scheduled in to Oyster Bay at 1:36 pm (it ALMOST made it!) with DE30AC #420 on the point; Teddy/Jim is shaking hands with Engineer Richard J. Bianchi while Conductor Steven S. Stochla (left, red buckle) and Assistant Conductor (a.k.a. Brakie) Donald G. Maltby (center, gold buckle) look on (thanks to Dave M. - 22 Sep 2002!):

TR/JF timing TR/JF greeting

Shaking Steve Stochla's hand and hamming it up in the cab:

TR/JF trainmen TR/JF cab
[Thumbnail images - click on the pictures for larger images.]

Next, we have the celebration itself, inside the waiting room (looking at the west wall), with TR declaiming, with TR doing the obligatory photo-op with Oyster Bay Town Supervisor John Venditto (who spoke very nicely, indeed), and with Vince Seyfried, noted LIRR historian, telling the story of the Branch and the station (clutching an excellent reference work - his compendious History of the LIRR, Part Six, with his finger in Chapter VI, "The Oyster Bay Extension"!
(Wonder how he ever found out about that invaluable book?)

TR/JF at OB 07Sep02 TR/JF intros J Venditto OB 07Sep02 V Seyfried OB 07Sep02
(cropped from 07 Sep 02 photos by D. Morrison - all rights reserved)
[Thumbnail images - click on the pictures for larger images.]

{that's I in the red #35 tee-shirt on the left, #35's founder Steve Torborg in one on the right,
with Cathy (Mrs.) Torborg facing at left}

That hideous green tile will come down, as will the drop ceiling; the original soaring arches are still there above that and the original woodwork under the falsework.  Dave dug through the east wall and found the original fireplace (no mantel, though - but it will be recreated).

Dave sent around this image of the fireplace from an old postcard (plus a closeup he sent with it) (22 Sep 2002):

D&H Cooperstown Station Waiting Room

D&H Cooperstown Station Fireplace (postcard courtesy of D. Morrison - all rights reserved)

Sucker trick!  It's from the D&H station in Cooperstown, New York, NOT Oyster Bay; I got so excited I posted it before I finished reading Dave's message!  I'm leaving it up as a guide to what we may find when we dig into the building or find a view of our own station somewhere.

Now, we still have to square away the discrepancies about whether or not that old structure is really the 1889 structure, renovated in 1902, and the two chimneys on the earlier building with the porte cochère!  The track layout had to have changed to accomodate the different shed arrangements, also.

* - I photographed and measured the station on 21 Sep 2002 and had to put this coverage up on this new page to accomodate the photos, dimensions, and other new information.

Photos first, primarily in a walk-around counter-clockwise from south to east to north to west:

N = North, S = South, E = East, and W = West.

First, the only angle I could get to show the whole front (south) side; there are buildings opposite that prevent a full frontal shot {Image 1}:

OB Station 2
[21 Sep 02 photos (except as noted) by and ©: 2002 S. Berliner, III - all rights reserved]

Well, that's not exactly right; there is, after all, a NW corner to the structures opposite and, looking NE from thence, here is what you see {Image 40}:

OB Station 40
[28 Sep 02 photo (this photo, only) by and ©: 2002 S. Berliner, III - all rights reserved]

The SE corner, showing the E end (a construction fence precludes an end-on view) {Image 2}:

OB Station 1

Next, a slightly closer shot of the E end of the S front lined up with the chimney {Image 3}:

OB Station 3

Similarly, the W end of the S front from across from the dormer/bay {Image 4}:

OB Station 4

Another shot of the E end of the S front from across from the dormer/bay {Image 5}:

OB Station 5

The dormer on the roof over the S front (that "black hole" just to the right of the bottom of the dormer is just that!  There is a bad hole through the roof at that point; that will be one of the very highest priorities when #35 gets access {Image 6}:

OB Station 6

Actually, the roof requires a total tear-off; there are far too many layers of old shingles for safety.

A close-up of the bay (under that thick and peeling white paint, the brickwork is in excellent condition) {Image 7}:

OB Station 7

The W end, almost unobstructed {Image 8}:

OB Station 8

The W end of the N side, showing the W side of the old ticket window {Image 9}:

OB Station 9

Another view of the N side, limited by the rail-side construction fence {Image 10}:

OB Station 10

The opposite end of the N side, the E end, again restricted by the fence {Image 13}:

OB Station 13

View of the N side gable (that bracket is relatively modern; don't even ask what it was for) {Image 14}:

OB Station 14

[Of course, if anyone out there REALLY knows what purpose the bracket served, please let me know.]

The savaged stub of the SE shed {Image 12}:

OB Station 12

East end view of the second floor with the valley between the stub shed roofs, the windows, and the chimney (it is actually the same size as the lower portion but necks down just above the roofline, out of sight in this high-angle view - you can see that on the second picture above) {Image 11}:

OB Station 11

And, finally, the west end view of the second floor {Image 15}:

OB Station 15
[21 Sep 2002 photos (except as noted) by and ©: 2002 S. Berliner, III - all rights reserved]


note-rt - All dimensions are from sharp brick edge to sharp brick edge (unless otherwise noted).
KEY:                    North Wall
		     "Ticket Window"
	     NW  ________|R QP O|__  ________  NE
		|T    S	          N M   L  K |
	West   U                             |  East
	Wall	|                            |  Wall
		|______  _      ____  _______|
	     SW  A  B  C D\___/F G  H  I   J   SE
			South Wall

		  C, H, M, and U are doors.

			C/D and F/G appear to be 60° angles
			D/E and E/F appear to be 30° angles


 45	SW corner to A
 36	A
 52	A to B
 36	B
 50½	B to door C (steel)
 39	C
 36½	C to W edge of Bay
(295" = 24' 6" - SW corner to Bay)
  8	NW edge of Bay to D (on angle)
 26	D (on angle)
  8	D to SW edge of Bay (on angle)
  8	SW edge of Bay to E
 42	E
  8	E to SE edge of Bay
(58" = 4' 10" - front of Bay)
  8	SE edge of Bay to F (on angle)
 26	F (on angle)
  8	F to NE edge of Bay (on angle)
 39½	NE edge of Bay to G
 36	G
 49½	G to door H (aluminum)
 34¾	H
 49	H to I
 36	I
 80	I to J
 48	J
 39 	J to SE corner
(411.75" = 34' 3¾" - Bay to SE corner)
( 58"    =  4' 10" - front of Bay)
(728.75" = 60'  8¾" w/o Bay)

Calculated and extrapolated Bay projections and widths:

    __          __ ____
      \        /    |
       \42  42/    ~36" deep
        \____/  ____|__
      |-|    |-|
      23  58  23


301¾"	SE corner to NE corner
	10	N wall to O
	32	O
	18	O to N edge of Ticket Window Wall
 60"    	Ticket Window East Wall


 40	NE corner to K
 48	K
 79	K to L
 36	L
 39½	L to door M
 39½	M  (aluminum)
 48½	M to N
 36	N
 33	N to Ticket Window E wall (O)
 32¾	Ticket Window E wall (O) to P-Q
 78½	P-Q (behind grille, equal halves)
 33	P-Q to Ticket Window W wall (R)

114	Ticket Window W wall (R) to S
 31	S
 68	S to T
 31	T
 45 	T to NW corner

 45 	T to NW corner
832¾" = 69' 4¾" NE corner to NW corner

	  832¾" = 69' 4-3/4"    North Wall
	- 728¾" = 60' 8¾" South Wall w/o Bay
	  104"  =  8' 8" Bay (front elev. view)
	-  58"  = flat Bay front
	   46"  = Bay sides laterally
	     divided in two extrapolates to:

	   23" each Bay side  (front elev. view)

	{I would guess these were actually even dimensions of 2' each*.}



301½" (= 25' 1½") NW corner to SW corner

LATTICE WINDOWS - moved to LIRR page 8 on 23 Sep 02.


South Overhang = ~82" plus 7½" corner post = ~90"

Triangles are 4:5 (H:W) -> ~72" (6') High to Shed peak

  [Nominal numbers (not allowing for trim thicknesses)]

           ___________     312½" = 26' ½" platform to roof peak
        /  \
       /    \
      /      \  3:2 high -> 108" high
     /        \
    /__________\            180" high = 15' - underhang to roof peak
   /\          /\
  /||\        /||\ ~72" high
 / ||~\      /~|| \
/  ||90\121 /91||82\ __
   | WEST WALL ||  /  |
   |   301½"   || /  57"
   |           ||/ ___|     132½" = 11' ½" - platform to underside of overhang
   |           |7½    |
   |           |     75½"
   |           |    __|
|                      |________ Street
* - the rectangular dimensions of the diagonal sides of the south bay are indeed nominally 24" wide by by 36" deep.

The door sills are 7½" high.  The window sills are 5" high.

The "standard" window (A, B, G, I, L, N) heights are NOMINALLY as follows:  78" overall from underside of top to top of sill, 19" upper latticed panel height, 29"upper sash, 26" lower sash, and 2½" wood sill plate.  The bay windows (D, E, and F) and the ticket windows (O, P-Q, and R) are also these same heights.

The "standard" window sill widths are 40".

The bay window sill widths are:  D and F = 30" and E = 42". The ticket window sill widths are:  O and R 36" and the P-Q (one sill) sill width is 82".

Window J is 37¾" high, with an 18" upper sash and a 19" lower sash over a 60¼" wiide sill.  Windows S and T are 26½" high on 36" wide sills.

The major brackets under the north and south eaves are 6" wide and are on vertical plates 7½" wide, with a 4½" high scroll at the bottom (except on the end ones, which are only 3½" high - go figure).  The main brackets spring 75½" off the platform, 4½" above the scroll.  The roundels are 5" above the bottom of the brackets.

There is a 3¾" diameter Coast and Geodetic Survey elevation marker (monument) set into the N wall of the ticket window, centered 16" from the E end of the ticket window bay and 37¾" above the platform {Image 16}:

OB Station 16
(23 Sep 02 photo by and ©: 2002 S. Berliner, III - all rights reserved)

The wording reads:
{curved around the central index mark and T 39 / 1932}


ELEV 14.961 FEET

T 39

A number of other dimensional details follow on LIRR page 8.  It is not my intention to document the station for historical record; only for modeling and general reference.

Among these are sill heights and more door heights and photos of the detail under the eaves and of the interwoven bricks at the outer corners of the S bay.

[this page was separated out from my RAILROAD, LI Rail Road, and LI Railroads pages;
you might wish to see them also.]

You may wish to visit the Railroad Continuation Page, et seq.

of this series of Railroad pages.


  What happens to all this when I DIE or (heaven forfend!) lose interest?  See LEGACY.


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of this series of LIRR pages.

To tour the Long Island railroads pages in sequence, the arrows take you from the previous page to the LIRR index, to the first LIRR page, and on to pages 2 and up, then to the other LI railroads page, and lastly to the LIRR Historical Society page.

© Copyright S. Berliner, III - 2012  - all rights reserved.

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